This summary is part of our coffee-side chat series to help interpreters gain the business confidence to move forward in the RSI world and participate in developing a sustainable business model for RSI that will get all of us through the pandemic and beyond. This is a summary of the presentation by Naomi Bowman on May 4, 2020.
Every interpreter needs a high quality headset for RSI. But how do we know what makes a headset high quality? Price isn’t always a good indicator. You also need the right features.
We'll begin with definitions.
A 'headset' is a set of on-ear or over-the ear headphones with a microphone attached. Earphones and earbuds refer to in-ear designs which are not recommended or interpreters. We will primarily be talking about headsets, but some of you may prefer a desktop microphone with headphones and we will also discuss this option.
FEATURES
WIRELESS: Do not use wireless headphones or headsets (Bluetooth) for remote interpreting work. Wireless equipment creates an added vulnerability for both listening and for your outgoing interpretation.
CONNECTOR: Pay attention to the connector. You must be able to connect it to your computer. Most platform providers recommend a USB connection for stability. Basically, a USB headset bypasses your computer’s sound card and therefore simplifies the connection. Some computers and platforms do not work well with analog audio input jacks (which are normally ‘mini plugs’ or 3.5 mm or 1/8” plugs). Certain models like Dell and Lenovo have known issues with their audio input jacks. We’ve experienced this first-hand in my company. While it is possible to use non-USB connectors, more advanced audio skills may be required. USB is considered ‘plug and play’. Some models have multiple connector options so be careful to order the right one for your needs. If you end up with the wrong connector, be aware that adapters are in very short supply right now.
NOISE CANCELING: Look for this feature, especially with a microphone – it helps drown out ambient noise and prevent the incoming audio from feeding back into the microphone while you are interpreting.
CONTROLLER: If you prefer to have a tactile, external volume, and mute controller, you must look for that. Some of you are comfortable using software controls for this. When you are in a virtual environment, it can be very easy to forget that you also need to mute/unmute if you are using an external controller and it can mean an additional step to think about. This is a personal choice. Most interpreters I talk to prefer a controller.
WEIGHT AND STYLE: Consider the weight and sound isolation (over-ear vs. on-the-ear). The lighter the better. If you do not have a very quiet environment available, an over-ear is worth considering. Weights can be just the headset, or the headset and cable together. Pay careful attention to what is included in the weight specs. Look for something under 200 grams – many are even under 100 grams. Be sure to get a ‘binaural’ model, which means double sided. Most interpreters prefer on-the-ear models as over-the-ear models tend to be heavy and bulky. If you do go with an over the-ear-style, please note that only 'open or 'semi-open' styles are advised for interpreters. 'Closed' over-the-ear style is not recommended.
FREQUENCY RESPONSE: The frequency response of both speaker and microphone should be 125-15,000 Hz. These specs can be hard to find in USB connector models, however. These may at first sound like confusing audio terms. But it is really quite simple: the lower end number represents low tones and the upper end number represents high tones. The reason for this ideal range of 125 to 15K Hz is so that you, as an interpreter, can hear well and be heard well. Microphones with a lower upper range – of say, 6000 Hz will yield a less crisp, clear sound to your listeners, with less high-note capability, and the same is true for the speakers. Anything above 20,000 Hz isn’t really practical for voice use, so a higher upper range does not provide an added benefit and is better for music listening. Another tech spec is impedance. As mentioned previously, USB mics are considered ‘plug and play’. Impedance levels of 16-32 Ohms are generally sufficient for a mic to be used with a computer and all of the microphones we will talk about are in this range. If you use a mic with an external amplifier, impedance levels must match. More information about this will be provided in a link at the end of the microphone list.
ACOUSTIC SHOCK: The most important thing I can say about acoustic shock is that each and every one of you should be aware of the phenomenon, educate yourself, and do what you can to limit your own risk to the extent possible and practical. Your hearing is essential to your work. So be knowledgeable! We could do an entire session on acoustic shock so, we will not go into detail here, but we will provide resources for all of you to learn more. Here are some basics:
All platforms are currently at the sole risk of the user. Interpreters are users
Some headset brands include limiters such as Sennheiser Active Guard or Plantronics SoundGuard. However, these limit to levels between 110 and 120 dB. Studies have shown acoustic shock can occur at lower levels and the maximum recommended limit is 85 dB. These limiters offer SOME protection.
You can use a software limiter on your computer (I use one that limits the volume to 50% unless I override it: https://www.element26.net/products/shop/volumelimiter/) and many of us in the industry are investigating external limiters for interpreting use. These are primarily made for music.
Turn the volume down. This is the best way you can protect yourself. Make sure your environment is truly quiet so that you can keep the volume as low as possible.
SPARE HEADSET or HEADPHONE/MIC: The headset/microphone is a common source of failure - be prepared with a spare set. Having two different models is also recommended in case there is a problem with one type on a particular platform, which can happen. I always recommend having more than one option available.
AND FINALLY, personal preference is important. You may need to try different models to see what you prefer and what fits and works best for you.
BRANDS & MODELS
These are a few models that have had positive feedback from interpreters. DS-Interpretation is currently contributing to a master resource list. Please keep in mind that at the moment, you may need to compromise because headsets are in very short supply. All the models I am going to mention are on-ear designs that are lighter weight than the over-ear models.
[NOTE: not all features/specs of each brand/model were mentioned due to lack of time. MODELS MARKED 'RECOMMENDED' HAVE BEEN RECOMMENDED BY INTERPRETERS FOR RSI AND MEETS BASIC SPECS]
SENNHEISER
Price: 135 EUR
Limiter: Activeguard 113 dB / ‘EU noise at work limiter to avg of max 85 dB over a workday’
Design: On-Ear
Controller: Yes
Connector: USB
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic 150-6800 Hz (note this is below the recommended range)
Frequency Response Speaker: 50-18K Hz
Weight: 89 Grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: Microphone Quality. The SC260 USB has received positive feedback from many interpreters but does not have a microphone that meets current recommended specifications. The older model had a better microphone.
PC 8 (RECOMMENDED)
Price: 30 USD / 35 EUR
Limiter: NO
Design: On-Ear
Controller: Yes
Connector: USB
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 90-15K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 42-17K Hz
Weight: 84 Grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: Some complaints about mic being fuzzy, but meets specs. Please note: this headset shows consistent issues using the Microsoft Teams platform. We welcome input based on experience in the field.
PC 131 (no longer on the Sennheiser website but still available to purchase)
Price: 150 USD / 80-130 EUR
Limiter: NO
Design: On-Ear
Controller: Yes
Connector: dual 3.5 mm
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 80-15K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 30-18K Hz
Weight: 91 Grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: Connector is not USB; awaiting feedback from interpreters and users.
KOSS
CS300 USB (RECOMMENDED)
Price: 50 EUR / 50 USD
Limiter: No
Design: On-Ear
Connector: USB
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 20-22K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 20-22K Hz
Weight: approx. 97 grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: No controller.
LOGITECH
H570e (RECOMMENDED)
Price: $29 USD
Limiter: No
Design: On-Ear
Controller: Yes
Connector: USB
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 20-16K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 31.5-20K Hz
Weight: 111 grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: Good specs for the price. May have issues on some platforms (e.g. Voiceboxer). We are gathering info.
Price: $29 USD
Limiter: No
Design: On-Ear
Controller: No
Connector: USB
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 100-16K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 20- 20K Hz
Weight: 100 grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: No controller. A great budget option. Very hard to find. Reported issues on some platforms -gathering info.
Price: $15 USC
Limiter: No
Design: On-Ear
Controller: No
Connector: TRRS dual plug 3.5 mm and NOT compatible with Chromebooks or Macs
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 100-16K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 20-20K Hz
Weight: 74 Grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: Connector is not USB and is not compatible with Chromebooks/Macs.
Price: $129 USD
Limiter: No
Design: On-Ear
Controller: Yes
Connector: USB and USB 3.0 included
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 100-16K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 20-16K Hz
Weight: 211 Grams (headset)
COMPROMISE: Weight, price.
CYBER ACOUSTICS
Headset Price: $39 USD
Limiter: No
Design: On-Ear (Very large)
Controller: Yes
Connector: USB
Noise Cancelling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic:100-16K Hz
Frequency Response Speaker: 20-29K Hz
Weight: 168 grams (total weight).
Note: this product is designed for school use. The earmuffs are large but not over-ear for adults and are large on-ear.
COMPROMISE: Weight and style. Unsure of full duplex audio status. Waiting for feedback from interpreters.
JABRA
EVOLVE 40
Price: 120 EU
Limiter: No
Design: On-Ear
Controller: Yes
Connector: USB / USB 3.0
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 100-10K Hz (note this is below the recommended range)
Frequency Response Speaker: 100-10k (note this is below the recommended range)
Weight: 173 grams (assume total weight)
COMPROMISE: Mic/speaker quality. A little on the heavy side. Full duplex audio. (Excellent customer service from the Company)
PLANTRONICS (POLY) 7200 series
Price: 150 USD
Limiter: Yes, ‘Soundguard’ to 118dB with over time weighted average of max 85dB software available ‘Plantronics Hub’ to limit Soundguard to 102dB
Design: On-Ear
Controller: Yes
Connector: USB / USB 3.0
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response Mic: 100-8K Hz (note this is below the recommended range)
Frequency Response Speaker: 10-20K Hz
Weight: 138 Grams (headset only)
COMPROMISE: Weight and microphone quality. Does NOT support full duplex audio which means that sound may cut out. No Plantronics products currently do, that I know of. Some models also require a Bluetooth connection in addition to USB which is not recommended.
UPDATE on POLY, Jul 9, 2020: Full duplex audio is supported. Corrected information provided by the Global Brand Manager. Please also note that a new model, the Blackwire 8225, has been released which has a greater microphone Frequency Response range and additional advanced active noise canceling features. See the press release here.
DESKTOP MICROPHONES
A great choice if you cannot find a USB headset OR if you prefer to use your own headphones (to be used with separate headphones or earphones without an integrated microphone)
Price: $130 USD
Noise Canceling: Yes
Frequency Response mic: 20 - 20K Hz
Has built-in headphone amp that you can plug headphones into (3.5 mm jack) to control volume and mute; Frequency Response is 15-22K Hz. This unit is a side-address microphone that should be used only pointed to the ceiling.
LEARN MORE from a handy source that also sells nice music listening equipment:
IMPEDANCE - What Is Headphone Impedance?
FREQUENCY RANGE - Guide to Headphone Frequency Response
PANEL QUESTIONS
Klaus Ziegler, HAMBURG
Q: Tell us what your favorite headset is.
A: FOR RSI: Logitech H340 USB
Q: We know there is an ISO Publicly Available Specification for Interpreting Delivery Platforms that came out in January. Do any USB headsets meet those specifications and what can we expect in the future with respect to Standards?
A: NO USB HEADSETS currently meet all the ISO standards (note that there are several standards to be met -not just one standards document). RSI is all about COMPROMISE. Hub-model RSI allows interpreters to work in a higher standard environment with conventional equipment and should be used whenever it is possible and practical to do so. Right now, the Publicly Available Specifications are being reviewed and updated for a June meeting and the hope is that the actual Standards will be published by the end of the year or early 2021. https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:std:iso:pas:24019:ed-1:v1:en
Many of us are working with manufacturers to have a headset developed for remote interpreting that meets standards and needs and we hope to make progress on that in the very near future.
Igor Zoubko, MRY
Q: Tell us what your favorite headset or headphone & mic is.
A: Headphones: AKG K812. I also have a K701 and K271 MKii as a backup. GLOBAL-Current $1500 USD
Microphone: Shure SM7b. 400 USD. The Shure SM7b mic has a sonic signature tailored for voice and has been a staple in broadcast and recording studios for years. It is a dynamic microphone (as opposed to a condenser microphone) and, due to it's much lower sensitivity, does not pick up room noise. It is also extremely well isolated against EMI (electromagnetic interference) and has a built-in pop filter to attenuate those unpleasant plosives. Also, it's built like a tank and is virtually indestructible.
In-line amplifier for the Shure mic: Triton Audio FETHead. It provides about +25 dB of extra gain for the mic which is very power hungry. https://www.tritonaudio.com/fethead $70
USB Interface: Sound Devices USB Pre2. $900 https://www.sounddevices.com/product/usbpre-2/
In the past, I have also used the Cenntrance Mic Port Pro. The current Cenntrance model is Mic Port Pro 2 (but I have not tried it).
Q: How much can we expect to pay for high end gear and is it worth the investment?
A: [Igor paid about $2500 for his setup, getting some discounts]. The overall benefit provided by the whole set up is crystal-clear incoming and outgoing sound, absolutely natural voice reproduction, even with Zoom's slightly lower sound quality (32 kHz sampling frequency for audio as opposed to 44.1 kHz which is standard for CD-quality sound). There's absolutely no ear fatigue even after interpreting sessions lasting 3+ hours, plus the benefit of being able to hear the slightest nuances of a presentation even when the speaker is using a basic headset or speaks into the built-in notebook mic. It's like a powerful, rugged, and reliable microscope for a sound which just makes my job so much easier. Of course, one is still only as good of an interpreter as the last session he or she has completed, fancy gear notwithstanding
Cyril Flerov, WASHINGTON, DC
Q: Tell us what your favorite headset or headphone & mic is.
A: During the event, \Cyril used a Plantronics BLACKWIRE C5220 but can’t recommend it because of the microphone quality. He is testing out a Tascam US-2x2 USB Audio/MIDI Interface with Microphone Preamps and iOS ($169) to use with high end headphones (Beyerdynamic DT394SIS, see review here), and will keep us posted.
Q: What is one thing that everyone participating today can do to help manage their own risk of acoustic shock?
A: Everyone should educate themselves above all. Read his article about what every interpreter should know about decibels and acoustic shock. The article found here.
Here are his slides on the topic: https://app.box.com/s/s09t3lrxmn9i5tsusvl7
Naomi also commented recommends the NIOSH Sound Meter App, to inform people about noise levels: https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/noise/app.html
Earbuds: It came up in Q&A as well that EARBUDS should be avoided as a best practice against acoustic shock. Bone conduction headsets and headphones should likewise be avoided as they create a greater risk of acoustic shock.
Maha El-Metwally, BIRMINGHAM, U.K.
Q: Tell us what your favorite headset or headphones & mic is.
A: Bose Triple Black using a cable (not wireless). 180 EUR.
*Maha is currently experimenting using this with a Blue Yeti microphone.
Q: What is the best practice response when you cannot hear well enough to work and what is the top recommendation you have for preventing such a situation, that is controllable?
A: Best practice is to make sure you have the right equipment and also to make sure that your contract says you will say ‘unable to interpret’ or ‘inaudible’ if you cannot hear well enough to work. It is important to convey this to the client, so their expectations are met. There are often difficulties with connectivity with RSI which make hearing the presenters or participants difficult at times. To help prevent such a situation - remember that it ‘takes 2 to tango’ – clients must also be aware of audio quality and be encouraged to use headsets and do everything they can on their end so that interpreters will be able to hear. Interpreters may have the right equipment -- but if the client and participants don’t, and the interpreters cannot hear, they cannot do their job.
Q&A
Q: What are the links for the ISO standards?
Q: Is there any way to read the ISO standards without having to buy them? Could never find them in local libraries. It's a bit pricey. Is there a group buy, for instance?
A: Prices are based on user licenses. Most are 35 to 85 Swiss Franc.
Q: What are the possible reasons for echo/feedback in headsets? Any cures?
A: Igor: when testing gear there were some complaints of headphones bleeding into the microphone, it can be difficult to completely block out ambient noise. The one time I was able to avoid bleed was when I used a production quality mic about a foot away from my mouth. However, in most cases, there will be minimal sound bleeding, a bit unavoidable if you’re not using in-ear headphones [which are not recommended due to acoustic shock risk].
Q: What do you think about a chair-mounted backdrop?
A: Naomi: A Green or Blue Screen is definitely recommended to help provide a professional impression and appearance, but also to provide some sound absorption as well. You can get one for the back of your chair, or a larger one that uses a tripod. They cost between $50-$100. Note that a computer’s camera or a separate camera can cause issues in coverage for the back-of-the chair option (and also even larger screens) because of the wide-angle lens.
Q: Do you know which one was the most voted ideal headset?
A: So far, we have no votes for an ideal one. We are trying to have the ideal one manufactured!
A group of us are talking to several manufacturers.
Q: What about Sennheiser SC 60/160 or 260 ML USB? They are quite popular here
A: The SC 60 /160 is a budget friendly option but the microphone frequency response is not good enough. It does have a controller and noise canceling microphone. The ML stands for Microsoft Lync. Same issue with the microphone. With the current global shortage if you already have one of these, use it. Ask for feedback from clients and listeners and please share your feedback with us. We are contributing to a public document that will soon be available as a resource with information on as many headsets, headphones, and mics as possible. The outgoing sound of the interpretation is the biggest issue with these models. There MAY be some problems on certain platforms (like Microsoft Teams). Some platforms recommend these brands.
Q: Is it a good choice to use Blue Yeti with Sennheiser HD 200 PRO headphones?
A: The Sennheiser HD 200 PRO headphones are big, bulky over-the-ear style, and relatively heavy (closer to 200 g). My understanding is that they are a pretty low budget ‘monitoring’ headphones that have an OK frequency range. Simply, they aren’t that good and need the volume to be turned up. That can be a bit of a red flag for hearing protection in general. If you like them, find them comfortable, can hear well, and are not turning the volume up too loud, use them. A lot of this is a matter of personal choice. IF you don’t own them, I recommend something lighter and a little higher quality. A group of us are also working on a list of headphones to be used with a desktop microphone.
Q: I have a Yeti Nano and it's an excellent microphone, but it will pick up everything, even cars that pass by. Is there anything that can be done to reduce or eliminate unnecessary noise?
A: Be sure, first that you are using this in the correct vertical position (pointed to the ceiling). Since it is a side-address mic this can be an issue. The Nano is a somewhat lower quality microphone than the regular Yeti but I do not know the difference regarding this makes for this particular issue. Provide as much sound baffling in your workspace as you can, you can even look into a ‘sound shield’ to put behind the microphone. Marantz makes one that is about $100. You can also design something similar yourself. Option here or look for an Aokeo AO 302 (about $39 USD).
Q: Naomi, you mentioned you’re meeting with manufacturers. Are you looking into a group buy where they’re designing certain products specifically for interpreters to buy?
A: Yes, a number of us in the industry are meeting with several manufacturers to convince them to design an interpreter headset that will be ISO compliant and work well for RSI. We hope to have new info on this soon.
Q: Has anyone tried Sennheiser PC 131? If so, thoughts?
A: This microphone is on the list of suitable options for interpreters. It does meet the basic specs. It does NOT have a USB connector and has a dual mini plug. We welcome feedback from any users.
Q: Any hope that RSI will just go away?
A: RSI will not go away in the view of most of us. However, it should be used as the best fit/ highest-standards approach, in our view. There will be more of it even after the pandemic. We do predict the rise of hubs, which offer a higher quality standard all around, once the pandemic lockdowns and restrictions loosen. But where RSI is the most appropriate solution for clients, it will remain. The hope is that we can help raise the standards for RSI over time.
Q: Would it be okay if we share the synopsis with our colleagues who were unable to join this session?
A: Absolutely.
Q: Plantronics vs. Sennheiser?
A: Plantronics currently does not have any headsets that have microphones that are of a high enough quality for RSI based on current proposed standards, and their headsets do not support full duplex audio (which means when you are interpreting you will have audio cut in and out because you cannot have 2 people talking at the same time, as on a telephone). They are designed for call centers, primarily. Sennheiser does have some models which have high quality microphones and support full duplex audio. For now, we recommend Sennheiser models on the list because of this. HOWEVER, if availability is an issue, a Plantronics model may work for some situations with known compromises. They are comfortable and get good reviews. Cyril Flerov was using a Plantronics when he spoke. The Company has good customer service.
Q: If in a conventional setting, would you recommend you bring your own headset to minimize Acoustic Shock?
A: From a legal perspective, yes, bring it – any contractor should supply their own tools and equipment to the extent possible and practical. From a technician's perspective, you may end up not using it due to a variety of issues concerning outgoing levels, adapters, and microphones. Also, they might not actually protect you from acoustic shock. Most headsets do not. If there is recording, levels need to be consistent and your headset might not be compatible; if a different microphone has to be used as well (as opposed to the provided headset), this can be a problem. Be prepared to be flexible on the matter.
Q: Is it possible to start half an hour later as some people are fasting?
A: Because we are accommodating schedules across the globe, this time was chosen to allow the widest group possible without starting too late for Naomi who is based in Europe. We hope those who could not join will be able to join a future session and read this synopsis.
Q: Any suggestions on the type of computer should be used?
A: We will save this for another coffee chat, but a computer with an i7 processor and as much memory as possible is recommended (8 or 16). An i5 with 4 MB RAM is the absolute minimum requirement. Operating systems should be as current as possible.
Q: Would you recommend getting a separate camera or just used the laptop camera?
A: It is always better to have a separate camera; it will provide an optimal, adjustable view (rather than looking up at you from below) and also be a back-up to a system camera. Also, having a secondary device for a communication line/chat with your partner is recommended. What’s App is popular for this. In addition, we always recommend having a primary computer that is strictly devoted to RSI and a secondary device for glossaries, internet searches, and documents/prep materials. Use the RSI computer only for the platform while you are working.
Q: Do you think that large scale conferences will come back?
A: We probably will not see large conferences until there is a vaccine; however, the need to meet in person and connect will be stronger than ever once this pandemic starts lifting. Risk assessment planning will play a role in determining whether to meet in person or not or to what extent. Clients will have to determine whether the risks are worth it. Meetings may be smaller, and we expect more ‘Hybrid’ meetings – with more remote participants, some remote presenters, and smaller groups on-site to meet social distancing requirements. The size of events will be dictated by authorities and by travel restrictions. Dispersed (working from home) and hub RSI are expected to continue to be part of the conference landscape, along with on-site conventional SI. We, therefore, recommend learning more about RSI in order to keep working -- and it is possible to get yourself set up to do RSI without spending a lot of money.
Additional Notes from the Discussion
Ethernet Connection: a hard-wired connection is always best. This can be difficult to achieve and may require wiring with a staple gun with U-shaped staples. You can hire someone to get this done. If your computer does not have a port, you will need an adapter. If there are issues with the connection and it’s a MacBook Pro, try the other side or try the side opposite where you have the power cord. Keep the ports balanced in terms of what you have plugged into them. There are known issues with this. On other computers, try other ports with other adapters and keep us informed. Use the best computer you can with a recommended i7 processor and plenty of memory -8-16 MB RAM (minimum i5 and 5 MB RAM).
Contracts are meant to reduce risk. Your risk. Push risks associated with RSI back where they belong: onto the end-user client. No interpreter should ever be asked to take on the risk of what can go wrong with RSI when it is out of their control. Provide assurances of what you can guarantee as a professional, such as a computer with certain specifications, a quality headset (and spare), a high-speed internet connection – but you can never guarantee there will not be internet connectivity issues or that a certain speed will be achieved. You will be providing a knowledge based service that is a best human effort, and that needs to be in the contract.
RSI involves compromise. A best-fit/highest-standard approach to providing a solution is always recommended. However, for now, RSI is all that is available in most places. The Hub approach, which offers a much higher standard of working conditions for interpreters, is possible in Germany and the Netherlands currently. Try to work in the highest-standard environment possible, when circumstances permit.
A business-minded approach to RSI will inspire confidence to get the job done well. Break down the complexities of RSI into smaller things to learn about. Focus on what you can control, and not what you cannot control. RSI involves compromise, but for now, it is all we have. Flip the concept of ‘your needs’ around: everything you demand in terms of working conditions and needs is actually for the benefit of the client – you are talking about THEIR needs! Interpreters cannot serve client needs unless their own needs are met to do the job – well. This is the essence of an empowered, business-driven approach to working with RSI as a necessary and appropriate tool in the virtual world.
END
Naomi Bowman, CEO
DS-Interpretation, Inc.